DID WE EXIST BEFORE WE WERE BORN?

Were we living with God as spirit children before we came to earth?

Where did you come from?

Not where were you born.

Where did you come from?

Did you exist somewhere before your mother gave birth to you?

Were you already a conscious person?

Did you know God?

Did you make decisions?

Did you live with Jesus?

Those are fascinating questions.

But fascination isn't evidence.

So once again:

WHAT DOES THE BIBLE ACTUALLY SAY?

1. WHAT LATTER-DAY SAINTS TEACH

Let's allow Latter-day Saints to explain their own belief.

Current official LDS teaching says that before we were born on earth, we lived in God's presence as His spirit children.

In that premortal existence, God's spirit children learned, exercised agency, and participated in Heavenly Father's plan. Jesus Christ was the Firstborn Son, while Lucifer rebelled and became Satan. Church of Jesus Christ

That is not a minor LDS teaching.

It is part of their explanation of:

Where did we come from?

Why are we here?

Where are we going?

But our question is not whether the teaching is attractive or whether millions believe it.

Our question is:

DOES THE BIBLE TEACH IT?

2. “BEFORE I FORMED THEE...I KNEW THEE”

One of the passages often connected with premortal life is Jeremiah 1:5:

“Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee...”

At first glance, that sounds convincing.

God knew Jeremiah before Jeremiah was born.

But notice exactly what the verse says.

It does not say:

Jeremiah lived with God before he was born.

It says:

God knew Jeremiah before He formed him.

Those are not necessarily the same thing.

3. GOD CAN KNOW SOMEONE BEFORE THAT PERSON EXISTS

The Bible repeatedly describes God knowing beforehand what He intends to do.

Romans 4:17 speaks of God as the One who:

“calleth those things which be not as though they were.”

God's foreknowledge does not require the thing He knows to have already happened.

Consider Cyrus.

More than a century before Cyrus accomplished God's purpose, Isaiah names him:

“Thus saith the LORD to his anointed, to Cyrus...”
— Isaiah 45:1

God knew Cyrus.

God had a purpose involving Cyrus.

That does not require Cyrus to have been consciously living in heaven waiting to be born.

So Jeremiah 1:5 proves something magnificent about God's knowledge and purpose.

It does not by itself prove a premortal human life.

4. WHAT ABOUT “THE FATHER OF SPIRITS”?

Hebrews 12:9 says:

“Shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?”

Does that mean God literally produced our spirits in heaven before our earthly births?

Look at the comparison.

The writer contrasts:

“fathers of our flesh”

with:

“the Father of spirits.”

The point concerns God's superior fatherhood and authority.

The verse certainly teaches that our spiritual life comes from and belongs to God.

But it does not say:

Our spirits lived consciously with God before conception.

That idea has to be supplied from somewhere else.

5. “WE ARE ALSO HIS OFFSPRING”

Paul told the Athenians:

“For we are also his offspring.”
— Acts 17:28

Then:

“Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God...”
— Acts 17:29

Again, strong language.

But read Paul's argument.

He is explaining why people should not make idols of God.

If human beings are God's offspring, Paul says, we should not imagine:

“that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.”

Paul's point is our relationship to our Creator.

He says nothing about people living as spirit sons and daughters in heaven before birth.

6. WHAT ABOUT JOB?

When God questioned Job, He asked:

“Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth?”
— Job 38:4

Then verse 7 says:

“When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?”

Clearly, heavenly beings existed when God created the earth.

But notice God's question to Job:

“WHERE WAST THOU?”

God does not say:

You were there shouting with them.

The passage distinguishes Job from those heavenly beings rather than clearly identifying him as one of them.

So Job 38 demonstrates that heavenly beings existed before the earth.

It does not say that those beings were all future human beings.

7. WERE WE WITH GOD BEFORE CREATION?

This is where we need to distinguish something important.

The Bible certainly speaks about God's purpose for us before the world began.

Ephesians 1:4 says:

“According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world...”

Does that mean Paul and the Ephesian Christians were consciously standing before God when He chose them?

Not necessarily.

Paul also says God:

“predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ...”
— Ephesians 1:5

Notice the language.

They were destined for adoption.

The passage concerns God's eternal purpose in Christ.

It does not describe memories, conversations or decisions made by human spirits before birth.

8. PAUL MAKES THE POINT EVEN CLEARER

Second Timothy 1:9 says that God's:

“purpose and grace...was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began.”

God's plan existed before we did.

That is different from saying:

We personally existed before the world began.

God can purpose something concerning us before our birth without requiring us to be present when He formed that purpose.

9. JESUS REALLY DID EXIST BEFORE HIS BIRTH

Now something interesting happens.

When the New Testament discusses Jesus, it speaks very differently.

Jesus says:

“Before Abraham was, I am.”
— John 8:58

He prays:

“Glorify thou me...with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.”
— John 17:5

John says:

“In the beginning was the Word.”
— John 1:1

And:

“The Word was made flesh.”
— John 1:14

Jesus' premortal existence is stated directly.

He existed.

He possessed glory.

He was with the Father.

He created.

Then He became flesh.

10. DOES THE BIBLE SPEAK THAT WAY ABOUT US?

This is an important comparison.

Where does Scripture say:

Before Abraham was, you existed?

Where does it say:

You had glory with God before the world existed?

Where does it say:

You lived consciously with Heavenly Father before birth?

Where does it describe:

your premortal decisions?

Where does it say:

you chose God's plan before coming to earth?

Those are major claims.

We should expect clear biblical evidence for them.

11. WHEN DID ADAM BECOME A LIVING SOUL?

Genesis gives us another important passage.

God formed Adam:

“of the dust of the ground.”

Then God:

“breathed into his nostrils the breath of life.”

And:

“man became a living soul.”
— Genesis 2:7

Notice the sequence.

The text doesn't say:

God placed Adam's already-living heavenly spirit into a body.

It says:

MAN BECAME A LIVING SOUL.

We should allow Genesis to describe human origins in its own language.

12. PAUL RETURNS TO ADAM

Paul quotes Genesis in 1 Corinthians 15:45:

“The first man Adam was made a living soul.”

Then he says something particularly interesting:

“Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.”
— 1 Corinthians 15:46

And:

“The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.”
— verse 47

Paul contrasts Adam and Christ.

Adam:

“of the earth.”

Christ:

“from heaven.”

That distinction deserves serious consideration if we are told that Adam—and all of us—actually came from heaven before earthly life.

13. “THE SPIRIT SHALL RETURN UNTO GOD”

Ecclesiastes 12:7 says that at death:

“the dust shall return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.”

Could “return” prove that our spirits previously lived consciously with God?

Not by itself.

The verse says God gave the spirit.

At death it returns to the One who gave it.

Nothing in the passage describes a premortal society, heavenly parents, a council, premortal choices or a forgotten previous life.

Those ideas must come from other passages if they are to be established.

14. WHAT ABOUT JACOB AND ESAU?

Romans 9:11 says:

“For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil...”

That is worth noticing.

Before Jacob and Esau were born, God's purpose concerning them was already known.

Yet Paul specifically says they had:

not done any good or evil.

If Paul believed Jacob and Esau had already lived a premortal life in which they exercised moral agency and made important choices, this would be an interesting way to describe them.

At minimum, Romans 9 gives us no description of such choices.

Instead, Paul's emphasis is God's purpose.

15. WHAT DOES THE BIBLE ACTUALLY GIVE US?

The Bible gives us a magnificent picture.

Before our birth:

God knew us.

God had purposes for us.

God's plan existed.

God could choose and call according to His foreknowledge.

But that is not the same as saying:

We were already conscious spirit persons.

We lived with Heavenly Father.

We participated in a heavenly council.

We exercised agency there.

We chose to follow Jesus.

Our memories were erased when we entered mortal bodies.

Those are additional claims.

The question is whether the biblical text makes them.

16. NOW APPLY OUR TEST

We have been using the same method throughout this series.

Don't begin by asking:

What have I always been taught?

Ask:

WHAT DOES THE TEXT SAY?

Jeremiah 1:5 says God knew Jeremiah before birth.

Read it.

Job 38 says heavenly beings rejoiced at creation.

Read it.

Hebrews 12:9 calls God the Father of spirits.

Read it.

Acts 17 says we are God's offspring.

Read it.

Ecclesiastes says the spirit returns to God.

Read it.

But then ask:

DO THESE PASSAGES ACTUALLY SAY THAT WE LIVED WITH GOD BEFORE WE WERE BORN?

That is the question.

17. DON'T ASK THE BIBLE TO SAY MORE THAN IT SAYS

There is nothing wrong with asking what happened before our birth.

But there is danger whenever we begin with a system and then make biblical phrases carry more than their authors actually said.

“I knew thee”

doesn't automatically mean:

“You lived with Me.”

“Father of spirits”

doesn't automatically mean:

“You lived as My spirit child in heaven.”

“Sons of God”

doesn't automatically mean:

“Every future human being.”

Those conclusions have to be demonstrated from the text.

DID WE EXIST BEFORE WE WERE BORN?

The Bible clearly teaches that God knew us before we were born.

It clearly teaches that God had purposes before the world began.

And it clearly teaches that Jesus existed with the Father before creation.

But those are not automatically the same claim as saying that all human beings lived consciously with God as spirit children before their earthly births.

That claim deserves to be tested separately.

Read the passages.

Then decide what they actually require us to believe.

TEXT B4 TRADITION

Read First. Conclude Later.

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